Gergely Kereki: Good evening. Tonight we’re broadcasting from a special location, the City Hall. Our guest in Eger is none other than Prime Minister Viktor Orbán. Good evening.
Good evening.
Prime Minister, you’re visiting Eger again. Perhaps we could start by asking you what your impressions are. I think it’s fair to say that over the past five years there have been many developments in Eger, not all of them positive. Now you’ve visited the local government and spoken to your colleagues. What do you see? What’s your opinion of the city’s leadership?
Eger is an important city. Obviously it is for the people who live here – because it’s their home. But it’s also important for the country, because I don’t think there’s anyone living in even the remotest corner of the country who can’t say at least two or three things about Eger – at least about István Dobó. So they know something. Eger is in the heart – or education, or mind – of every Hungarian. On the other hand, it also plays an important role regionally: without Eger, this area wouldn’t be able to thrive. It’s an archiepiscopal city, so it’s beautiful. There are physical reminders of the past here that are, of course, most important to the people of Eger, but that are also part of Hungary’s wider national cultural heritage. Politically it’s a very difficult place: there’s always a battle here. I don’t know how many campaigns I’ve seen in which the margin between winning and losing was really small. So it’s very difficult to win in Eger, and even more difficult to hold on to the city. The fortunate periods in Eger’s history have been those when the Government and the city leadership were of the same political persuasion. That’s when I think we need to make a big move, that’s when we need to move forward in a big way. Because when the two diverge, there’s always trouble here. So it’s always good for Eger’s development to have a pro-government city leadership. And sometimes that’s the case, sometimes it’s not. And now it is. So I think the city of Eger has a great opportunity and chance, because in the council there’s a pro-government majority. The city is led by Mr. Vágner, a Christian, civic-minded man of the Right; and the Government is a national government, and we’re working to ensure that this remains the case after April 2026. There’s a new mayor here, isn’t there? The legacy is – how shall I put it? – a heavy burden, so it’s difficult to run with it or win a race. I’ve also looked through the budget presented to us by the Mayor. We need to send at least 1.5 billion forints here by the end of the year to keep the budget from collapsing, so that we can have the stable financial management that’s expected and demanded by the people of Eger, so that the city can be run at the level expected by the them; because the people who live here are discerning, and have high expectations. The people who live here have high standards. And that poses a serious challenge for the city administration. But now we’re going to allocate one billion for this – or rather one and a half billion forints. The other woe afflicting your city is that the previous mayor sent us back 9 billion forints, for which we’re grateful. With the previous city administration I’d agreed on a strategy within the Modern Cities Programme, but the mayor who subsequently took office suddenly sent 9 billion forints back to the Hungarian state. Great! I don’t know why the people of Eger did this, but that’s their business. The Mayor has now said that he thinks it would be good to get that money back. So we’ve started negotiating on how Eger could get this 9 billion back for development purposes – over how many years, how, and for what. These negotiations are taking place right now, while we’re sitting here, between Minister Lázár and the Mayor. These are the biggest items. And there are also problems here that exceed the city’s budget by orders of magnitude, and which the city of Eger cannot even begin to address, because it’s not for them to solve. You know, there’s always a huge traffic jam here because it’s a city in a gorge, with traffic coming in from the surrounding valleys. I think that using Route 25 to connect Eger to the country’s motorway network was a great achievement, but now a bypass must definitely be built.
This is probably just as eagerly awaited as the M25.
We need to build the 25 bypass. I see that the political battles over this have been fought here, so we have a pretty good idea of the route that needs to be taken. This will be a 100-billion-forint project, so we’re not talking about child’s play – but we’ll do it during the government cycle between 2026 and 2030. So this will happen if we’re in government. But until then the final section of Route 25 is in poor condition, and the gentlemen in the other room are currently negotiating on how the resurfacing of this thorough road must also be carried out. If possible, this should be done in the autumn. I think this will happen. And there were other smaller items that I won’t even talk about here: the operation of the municipal swimming pool, the renovation of the Castle, and so on. So the Mayor and Member of Parliament Pajtók have big appetites, a lot of drive, and great ambition.
The Prime Minister mentioned that the legacy is difficult, the current situation is difficult, and that therefore help is being provided. How do you see Eger’s situation in, say, the next five to ten years? It has a fairly important cultural heritage, but at the same time we’ve heard from the Mayor several times that there’s work to be done economically. Considering the city’s characteristics, what are the points that could point to progress in the coming years?
I don’t want to say that they’re in an easy situation, because that wouldn’t be true. So, depending on the city, geographical location generally limits or expands the possibilities for industrial development. You’re in a very confined area, so it’s not possible to open 400–500-hectare industrial parks here – like one can in, say, Szeged or Pécs. So here a different type of industrial development is needed – one that requires much less space and has greater added value. This won’t happen automatically, because if it could, it would have happened already. So here state support for industrial development is needed. A few days ago there was a visit here by my colleagues who are trying to bring investments into the country and then distribute them. So we took note of this and agreed with the Mayor that we’d launch a joint industrial development initiative here and bring in industries that would fit in and suit the character of the city. Obviously we don’t need to bring aluminium rolling mills here, but instead we need to consider investments with higher added value, such as IT-type investments specialising in the service industry.
Bearing in mind where the city is now, what other opportunities does it need – whether from a cultural or, say, economic point of view?
Well, it’s a good place to live. I have friends in Eger, and I’ve been here several times before. So, as a family man, if I had to choose where to live in Hungary, and let’s say I didn’t choose Felcsút, because that’s obviously my first choice, then Eger would be a very serious contender for a place worth moving to. It has history, it has culture, it’s an archiepiscopal city, a calm city, so it’s not a hectic city, it has good schools, a beautiful city centre, and history. Now that the roads are in place, you’re an hour away from everything. Budapest is a little over an hour away, but Debrecen isn’t much further. I’ve come from Salgótarján, so it’s also open to the north. It’s a city with good potential if you want to live well. But you need to bring in very specific industries to generate money, which is why your business tax revenue is low. Despite the city’s beautiful features, it can’t make a penny from large-scale industry. What’s needed here are valuable investments based on real money. I think the University is also necessary for this. Sometime in the near future I’ll need to have a discussion with the Archbishop about this, to see how the University can be developed in such a way that it can also provide a background for urban and industrial development.
Incidentally, since you’ve mentioned universities, Prime Minister, if we look at good examples, how can such a university be involved in a long-term development plan for a city, for example?
The focus of your university is on teacher training, which is less marketable, so to speak. It’s much easier where technical training is at the forefront, as in Miskolc. But something can be worked out here too. The Archbishop is a man with a strong nation-building character, and the recent history of this city wouldn’t have come about – and it wouldn’t look so beautiful – if the Archbishop hadn’t been able to manage the entrusted or related areas and estates as he has done, resulting in there almost being an archbishop’s quarter in this city. So I believe that we’ll find cooperation in university development in a way that also promotes industrial development. But there’s no final agreement or concept on this yet.
There are areas where progress has already been made. For example, there’s the Castle. For that there’s a ten-year plan. We’ve talked about how culture and the Castle are unavoidable from Eger’s point of view. Let’s talk a little about the Castle and the cultural life of the city. What opportunities are there, and what role can the Castle play? Ten years isn’t a short time.
Of course these also bring in money, but let’s look at tourism. Because ultimately cultural services generate money mainly when people either buy tickets – which doesn’t get us very far – or come to the city, stay here, eat and drink here, and spend a weekend here. So tourism and the city’s cultural services are closely linked. I’ve just looked at the Mayor’s figures, and there’s business tax revenue from tourism, but it’s small. Of course those involved in tourism think that they pay too much tax, but in fact in Hungary taxes on tourism are low: by all comparisons, tourism is clearly a low-tax sector, and so it brings little revenue to the city, directly, to the city’s coffers. It brings revenue to citizens, because those who own hotels and restaurants and can sell services here naturally benefit from this on a private basis, but the city doesn’t make much money from it. Here a single large industrial plant pays two to three times as much in business tax as the entire tourism industry. Nevertheless, I believe that tourism should be developed. The primary consideration isn’t how much tax the city collects, but how it raises the city’s standard of living. Raising standards always brings in more visitors, which in turn brings in better industry and more revenue. So in Eger culture is something that’s apparently a financial burden, but overall it helps to keep the city at a level that makes it attractive for industrial investment. This is why it’s not enough to just talk about it – we have to invest money in it. And we discussed that too.
In essence we started the conversation by saying that this is a good opportunity for Eger in the coming years – or could be a good opportunity. If everything goes according to plan, where could Eger end up in the coming period?
For Eger to succeed there are now two important prerequisites that must be met, and these don’t depend solely on the people of Eger. One is that Eger must be a pro-government city. To achieve this, we must win the 2026 election, because otherwise the city won’t be pro-government. The other is that Hungary must have a national government. Of course we can talk about the future and opportunities, and that’s what excites me the most. But if, instead of a Hungarian national government programme, a Brussels government programme is implemented in Hungary, then we might as well shut up shop here – because the money will go to Ukraine. There will be no development here in Eger. So we need a national government, and a government that’s of the same political persuasion as Eger. This must be resolved by April 2026. Once we’ve resolved that, once we have that, then we can move forward with our plans.
What are the expectations from Eger’s point of view, for example? We already have a promise that the Government will help with the current budget. What do we expect from the city leadership, what do you expect for this to work properly?
It’s usually the other way around, because the Government doesn’t expect anything from city leaders, since we didn’t elect them. Their voters expect things from them, and if the voters are happy with how things are and satisfied with the work that’s been done, then they’ll re-elect them. The Government can offer a partnership. Of course, in order for people to be satisfied with their lives, there are a few prerequisites or basic conditions. First of all, they need to have their own home. We were just talking with the Mayor about how, at yesterday’s government meeting, we expanded the possibilities of the 3 per cent home creation loan to people who currently live in council housing: the council is willing to sell them, and we’ve changed the rules so that the 3 per cent home creation loan can also be used to purchase such homes. There’s a lot of council housing here. It’s not my job to decide on that – there’s a council and a mayor; but we’ve given a financial opportunity to those who want to buy their own property which is now rented from the council, and they can do so if the City agrees. So the first thing you need to live a happy life is your own home – otherwise you’ll be a drifter, or a “come-and-gone”, as is said around here. The other thing you need is a job. There was serious unemployment here before 2010, but we’ve roughly halved that. So in Eger and the surrounding area there are half as many unemployed people today as there were fifteen years ago. That’s still a lot, but a job is important. And that job should be one that pays a decent wage and offers growth. We’re currently negotiating with trade unions and employers to ensure that the minimum wage will increase by double digits next year – which will push up other wages as well. And we’re continuously reducing taxes so that people have more of their wages left in their pockets. For example, we’re now doubling the family tax allowance, and this will be felt immediately in people’s monthly pay packets. We’ve removed or abolished the income tax on childcare allowance [GYED] and infant support benefit [CSED]. This will immediately leave tens of thousands of forints more in families’ pockets every month. We’ve already abolished income tax for mothers of three, and from 1 January we’ll extend this to mothers of two. This will automatically mean a 15 per cent increase – albeit in several steps. So we’re working to ensure that not only are there jobs, but that salaries are decent and that as much as possible remains in people’s pockets. And the third thing is that people should feel that they’re not at the end of the world. This is why the issue of Route 25, which I struggled with for a long time, has been so important. I initially encountered it during my first term, between 1998 and 2002, and then I brought it up again in 2010 – because Eger was not only a town in a valley, but also isolated. So the feeling should be that your city isn’t an isolated place, but is connected to the country’s bloodstream, whether by public roads, railways or internet services, so that these distances can be overcome. And this is gradually happening in Eger. Now it will definitely happen with the 25 bypass. So I think that if there’s settlement of industry, if new industry comes to Eger, then – once the basic conditions are in place – it can be a calm, peaceful city, predictably developing step-by-step. There aren’t many cities in the country that can say that about themselves. So this is a city that stands on a firm footing, and – with a good mayor, a good council, good councillors and Member of Parliament – it’s a city that can be kept on a planned path of growth.
Of course, a little luck is also needed.
I think we summed things up in this last question. We’d like to thank the Prime Minister very much for talking to us and sharing his thoughts, and I think everyone in Eger is confident that these things will be realised in the coming period. Thank you very much.
What we agreed on today with the Mayor, the four or five major items, will all be realised before the election.
Thank you very much.
Thank you for the opportunity.
And thank you very much for your attention.